Flipping America 577, Indestructible Wealth

podcast 577, Indestructible Wealth

Jack Gibson

Jack Gibson has written Indestructible Wealth, what I think is the best business book I read in 2022. And I read more than 120 books last year. Our conversation included real estate, crypto currency, including bitcoin mining, investing in the stock market, wealth management, and multiple streams of income. 

Jack has the right ideas and has expressed them beautifully in this well-written book. He should charge $100 for it, but he doesn’t. 

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Quote of the Day

A wise person should have money in their head, but not in their heart. –Jonathan Swift

Expected Air Date: Mon 1/9/23        

Guest: Jack Gibson


[0:01] Jack Gibson has written Indestructible Wealth, what I think is the best business book I read in 2022, and I read more than 120 books last year.

Our interview went long, so this intro needs to be short. Here we go.

[0:14] Music.

[0:30] The show that teaches you how to make money in real estate. Wherever you are, whatever your situation, there is an opportunity for you.

[0:35] Music.

[0:41] Our show is brought to you today by the Flipping America REA. Join this incredible community of investors across the country now in 43 chapters with over 22,000 members from Maine to Honolulu and from Boston to Corpus Christi.

Check it out at FlippingAmericaRea.com. That’s FlippingAmericaRea.com.

Each week there’s a live stream meeting where you can ask questions, swap deals, chat with other investors around the country, get started or grow your own business.


[1:15] Thank you, Kathy Curtis, and hello, America. It’s great to see you today. I can’t wait to bring you this conversation that I have with Jack Gibson.

It’s coming up in just a few minutes, but first of all, just a little bit of housekeeping if you wouldn’t mind indulging me. You can find us on the web, flippingamerica.net, flippingamerica.net. The REIA is a separate website, flippingamericarea.com.

And if you have questions about real estate or real estate investing, Send them to questions at flippingamerica.net.

[1:46] We promise we will answer your question. We’ve answered thousands of questions over the years, and we will answer yours, even if we’ve answered it before.

And if you ask a good enough question, we’ll use it on the show. If you wanna find us on social media, Facebook.com slash Flipping America media, Twitter and Instagram at Flipping America, YouTube.com slash Flipping America.

And now, unless you’re driving while listening to this, Take your phone out, if you don’t mind, and enter in this phone number. I want you to text a word. The word is wit.

Enter the number 205-858-FLIP. That’s 205-858-3547.

Send the word wit.

Once you do that, enter your email. You’ll be subscribed to the weekly wit. Our newsletter, wit, stands for whatever it takes.

It has the week’s real estate and Flipping America news and investing tip, a joke, and a blessing. It’s usually about a seven minute read with some optional links.

Yes, that’s our breaking news, new stinger.

[2:51] And I’ve got this story. I don’t think they intended it to be comedy, but my friends at Reads is funny to me.

It’s from our friends over at Globe Street, and it’s in the notes today. Oakland, the city of Oakland, plans to build 36,000 new homes in a decade.

Woohoo. I’m just telling you, read the story, check it out, because any government that enters into the private business is just not gonna be good. Here’s Jack.

I’m Jack Gibson. Welcome back to the Flipping America Show.

Thanks for having me back, Roger. Super excited again. I’ve already told the audience listening how excited I am for this interview because of this book. But before we get into the book, let’s talk a little bit about the high return business and the turnkey rental business. And how’s that going? How’s Shecki doing?

[3:40] Yeah, everything’s great. You know, Roger, when everything was just exploding in real estate, right? The COVID money printing years, 20 and 21. We just couldn’t find too many deals that made a

lot of sense. The price to rent ratios were just way, way out of whack compared to what we were used to in 2016 through 2020. Oh, I remember having you on the show and you were talking about centers there in Indianapolis. And I’ve sent some people your way over the years.

And you’re taking them to come your way myself one of these days.

[4:12] Super appreciate the support and we flipped probably, I don’t know, I’d never really counted, I think it was like 250 to 300 homes in that period of time. And then we just really kind of just sold off our remaining inventory. We were looking to get out of C-class property and kind,

of upgrade, just playing Monopoly, the big boy Monopoly, right? You buy the four green little,

houses and then you trade those up into the one red hotel, you know, so I’m, I’m kind of selling off a lot of that we’re getting bigger deals, nicer deals, and I’m doing a lot in the self storage space as well. So Shecky is full time on the,

high return real estate company, and he’s kind of running the show there. And then I decided to pursue kind of my passion, which is mentoring other people that are really looking to grow a large wealth. And, you know, I really have a passion for younger guys, Roger, like the 20, 25, 30 year olds.

[5:10] I think simply because I’ve made so many mistakes in those years and I feel like I can help them avoid them. So, but at any rate, I help people at all demographics.

Yeah. Because, you know, I’m sitting here, I’m old enough to be your dad, but I want you to mentor me that based on this amazing book, which I’ve read in the past week and it’s called, uh, building an indestructible wealth and it’s going to be my number one recommended business book for the foreseeable future until something supplants it.

But man, it is a terrific book. You did a wonderful job. writing, great storytelling, and,

You know, I know a thing or two about writing and communicating and teaching, and you put it together in such a beautiful, logical way. So props to you, my friend. I know there was a lot of work involved in that. Let’s talk about that book for a minute, okay?

Yeah, let’s do it. All right. So, and I’m putting the website up there on the screen for those of you that are watching this. If you’re not watching, if you’re listening on the podcast,

It’s myindestructiblewealth.com. And you could go there and get a copy of this book for, I’ve already told Jack, too low. What’s the price?

$4.95. $4.95 for a book that seriously is life-changing. And Jack, as I was reading this book.

[6:34] I had this thought pretty much every third or fourth page, man, I wish somebody would have told me that when I was younger. Man, I wish I had known that when I was younger. Yes, I know that thing is true, but I didn’t learn that till I was 55. I wish I’d known it when I was 20. I.

[6:50] Wish I had heard it. And you know, it could be that my dad or somebody was willing to tell me, maybe I wasn’t interested in listening. I have to give a little credit there.

There’s typically a lot of that. You tell your story in the book, but tell a little bit about your story that drove the, what’s behind the book. Because I think it’s interesting. I think people would want to know,

it. Well, so when I wrote the book, Roger had been going through an extensive, called a brand builders group training. It’s a company that specializes in helping people that have a mission that they want to share, a message that they want to share. And they just don’t know how to really go about it, doing it in a systematic way.

But one, and it was, it’s been an amazing program, kind of helped me develop the whole brand name and, and, and the whole concept behind what I’m talking about.

But the biggest question they asked us, which is what I would say is really good advice for any of your listeners that they have a desire to get out of message to an audience, they got something in their heart that they really want to share.

And they think they could make an impact and make a positive difference in other people’s lives. They said, you are best equipped to help the person that you used to be.

[8:08] And so the question they said is who did you used to be? What problem did you solve for yourself that you can help somebody solve maybe quicker and more efficiently if they had your mentorship and guidance?

And I look back at it and like, you know, when I was 22 and for the subsequent, probably, you know, several years after, I definitely had some money struggles. You know, I was a successful entrepreneur in college.

I built up a pretty nice cash flowing business. I did not spend any money on anything. I mean, I literally had the same pair of sneakers my senior year of college that I wore my senior year of,

high school basketball. That tells you anything. I did not spend anything. So I banked up 50 grand, which in 1997 wasn’t a bad amount of money for a 20, 21 year old to get a hold of.

And so I did what I was told, right? Go out, buy a house, and invest your money into the stock market.

And well, my timing was absolutely terrible. That was 2000.

I invested in April of 2000, and by September, you know, the dot com bubble had burst, and I lost half the money almost instantly.

And it was just really depressing to lose 50% of your net worth, especially when you’re, you know, that young and you thought about, man.

[9:31] Like all the things I could have bought. I could have thrown some incredible parties, gotten some nice clothes, maybe done a better job at impressing the ladies, you know, new car, all of that. And it.

[9:42] Made me realize that I just didn’t have the right guidance. I didn’t have the right mentorship, and I didn’t have the right plan. So in the book is where, you know, I really kind of draw out the plan of how I think an entrepreneur would be best to invest. So, you know, we can dive into however.

[9:59] Much you want to dive into from there. Sometimes, Raju, as we know as humans, people can tell us all day long what their experience and wisdom and the mistakes that they’ve made, but sometimes

we just have to make them for ourselves. Yeah. Sometimes the greatest purpose in life that you serve is to be an example for others of what not to do. Maybe that’s how I turned out

after all. But one of the things I really cherish about what you said in the book was the influence of your parents and your mom making you go out and you cleared off that part on the back part

of your property to earn some money to get your Nintendo game or whatever. When you were talking about having the emotional maturity to recognize that it’s not that important to acquire these

things that you think will earn you that respect. Okay, one of the things is an awareness that that’s even an issue.

Yeah. Because I think about my own life and I wasn’t even really aware that that’s what I did, or why. I knew that I was basically following in the footsteps of my own father who would get,

some money and then we’d have some good things for a while and then it would be rough for a while.

[11:21] You know, sort of a cycle. And there was never anything steady. And then I grew up and did the same thing, but it wasn’t a conscious decision. It was just maybe a learned behavior pattern.

And it took really reading and getting some coaching and so forth before I understood. So I think it begins with that understanding. And this is another reason people need to get your book right now. It doesn’t matter if you’re 60 or if you’re 16, you need to get this book.

[11:51] Well, if you’re 16, you need to ask your parents if you can read some R-rated language. I have a clean version too. I’ve got that available for anybody that would prefer.

That’s all right. Well, I’ve got a whole thing. I used to be a youth pastor among other things, and we would talk about the whole panoply of bad words, but it’s just a combination of syllables.

Anyway, so there you have it. Everybody needs to read this book because at some point, everyone needs to develop the awareness that there is this issue out there.

[12:31] I did the same thing, Roger. I mean, and I’m not sure if I talked about this particular part in the book, but when I was just graduated from college, after that event, after losing half,

that money, I’m like, okay, I’m just going to go do what I want to do and get the nice thing.

So I went out and bought a brand new BMW and then my business dropped a bit.

And then on top of that, I already had a car that was fine.

Yeah. Oh, I did. Okay. And like, why did I do that? Well, well now I look back.

It’s very, very obvious. I wanted to be respected. I felt very dis-respective because I was in an alternative business model during college and the kids would always make their sarcastic jokes about it.

So I wanted to just give them the big middle. And that was the way that I felt like I could do it.

[13:17] Yep. you even use that phrase in the book. Yeah. And then, but the problem is then you pay the price after because you do it, you do it for the wrong reasons and your heart’s not in the right place, then you’re going to feel the repercussions financially after that.

Well, all of our life is a process of growing self-awareness, right?

[13:44] This whole issue of respect and a man’s pride and there’s a balancing point in there because you do need to have a certain amount of pride. That pride is what prompts you to do things well, to pursue excellence.

To become prideful is when you cross the line and where is that line and so forth. I don’t know, but one of the things that helps me is I tend to read books that I still can’t understand.

You know, astronomy and physics and the math, I can’t do.

[14:19] And I also read the Wall Street Journal to basically get exposed to people with wealth beyond my imagination.

[14:28] And the type, even, you know, you talk in the book a little bit about mid-cap, large-cap, small-cap companies, you know.

I have a long way to go to even be a small-cap. All of that is humbling and all of that is also good, right? Because of the perspective.

And so, you know, your book is not just practical steps, but there was a, in my case, it was a reminder of some perspective things that I learned but only later in life and even now,

they are not always at the front of my brain. So I appreciate that very much about your book.

Everyone should read this book, Building Indestructible Wealth. All right. Can we dive into some of the components? Yeah, please. Let’s do it.

You know, one of the things that’s been a real challenge for me doing the Flipping America show is, you know, I made my bones flipping houses and then I got into rental houses, the end.

And now I talk to all these people that do all these different things and every one of them is like a shiny object or a squirrel. I want to go do that. And then I read about streams, multiple streams of income and I’ve done a lot of reading on that topic and so forth and I’ve,

decided to make my multiple streams of income all pretty closely related to the real estate thing,

that I do. And here comes Jack Gibson telling me I need to invest in crypto.

[15:56] Well, here’s the thing, Roger, and we’re seeing this currently in the market. For example, like, you know, look at people that had all their money in stocks. I mean, you know, this has been a really terrible year.

[16:08] I have stocks and yet my net worth didn’t drop during this entire crash this year. Why is that? Well, I have it as a part of my portfolio. It’s not my entire portfolio.

[16:25] My belief is, and I do absolutely agree 100%, if you try it too early where you try to create all these different buckets of income without really hyper focusing on one, you will have multiple streams of distraction, not multiple streams of income.


So my belief is that, especially for entrepreneurs, that you need to stay hyper, hyper focused on one thing, get really, really world class at that thing and just go all in on that one thing.

And then when that starts kicking off, more cashflow and more excess cashflow, I should say, then what makes sense to invest back into your business and what you need to live off of,

then that’s the time where, yes, you need to start diversifying into other asset classes.

[17:14] I don’t think that, at one point I had, I think 20 different streams of income. It was just too many. I tapped out. We’re consolidating that down to something that’s more manageable and reasonable.

The reason I did that is the main thing is just wanted to learn and I think the only real way to learn about a different investment or asset class is you got to get into it. You got to do it.

Right. Well, also you want to be respected.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We already said that. No, and that’s very true. I still to this day, I mean, I think it’s absolutely true. I don’t deny it. I just try to make sure that doesn’t get out of control, right? And there’s a healthy amount,

that motivates you. So I did my first business from the time I was 19 all in and I didn’t do anything else.

All in on that business for the first, I want to say minimally 10 years. And it really wasn’t until 15 years in that I started my other, my second company, which is Tyreturn Real Estate.

And then since then, I’ve started Indestructible Wealth, which is my financial education company. And then I also started a Bitcoin mining company as well.

So it’s a process that unfolds. If I had taken on more than one thing, I don’t think I would have been successful on either.

So quick question, is it too late for me to buy equipment and become a Bitcoin miner?

[18:42] This is a great time to do it actually, Roger, because you want to buy assets when they’re on sale, right? When there’s, as Warren Buffett said, there’s blood in the streets, right? Well,

there’s definitely blood in the streets for the miners. Now, fortunately for us is that we’re a small operation. I bootstrapped the whole thing. So we have no debt. So right now,

I mean with Bitcoin being down substantially from its high, for a lot of the miners out there, it’s at the point where they’re not even breaking even anymore. So now on top of that,

they have all these debt payments. So the miners are, a lot of miners are capitulating,

and that’s creating a release of equipment that’s going on.

I was going to say, so if you’ve got some cash, you could pick up some Bitcoin mining equipment.

Yeah, we’re, we’re picking up, um, equipment right now. I mean, I can’t even believe what the prices are. It’s so juicy.

Um, but the problem is Roger, like if somebody goes out and they, they go and say, oh yeah, I want to buy some Bitcoin mining equipment.

Well, that’s the small problem. It’s just buying the equipment. The major problem is getting it plugged in and hosted and actually working.

And that’s the part that’s taken us a year to set up for ourselves. Wow. Yeah.

[20:02] Yeah. It’s no, it’s no easy task. Now, if you’re just going to plug in one machine, that won’t take you long at all. I mean, you could, in all likelihood, you could get an electrician into your house.

You could rewire a, you know, a standard washer dryer outlet to be the right, you know, voltage and amps and everything you need.

And you could probably mine that one machine, but if you want to scale it, and, and I really believe that in order to really make money with it, you got to have multiple machines, you got to scale the operation. The problem is that you need to get some serious equipment to be able to do that. And that’s what we’ve done.

Here’s another thing though, with Bitcoin being down right now, wouldn’t this be a good time just to buy Bitcoin?

[20:45] Absolutely. I mean, there’s nothing wrong at these prices, which is fine. December 2022 as we speak, by the way.

Yeah. So for example, as of right now, December 22, Bitcoin’s trading at 17,800, right? So with the brand new S19, 140-terra hash, that means how much computing power they have.

You can mine a coin for right around, I want to say 11,000 price, right? So you’re getting it at not quite a 50% discount, but you’re getting it substantially lower than even what,

the low is right now.

That’s the nice thing about doing it right now. Then when Bitcoin does go back up, it will inevitably go back up.

You’re making money on two parts, on the mined and held Bitcoin, but then the machines drastically become more valuable.

As Bitcoin, when Bitcoin doubles, the machines will more than double in their value.

So you have two net worth accelerators there by mining. But nothing against just buying the coin and doing that. There’s certainly a good play.

Buy a couple of machines, buy some coins, and use kind of like a little bit of dollar cost averaging there.

[22:08] That’s essentially what Bitcoin mining is doing. You’re just your dollar cost averaging over the cost over the course of five to eight year period.

[22:18] All right. Another thing that I like about your book, not the thing, another thing I like is you’ve got practical steps. Even for people who read this and are curious about technology and so forth like me, you’ve got a glide path and an action step where people can actually get involved,

in some of these things. And it’s not just the Bitcoin. You had a newsletter or something that.

[22:48] Recommends altcoins that people should look into and different things like that.

[22:54] I think maybe one of the things that I really appreciate is the fact that you have a balanced perspective on these things and you don’t necessarily toe the industry line when it comes to the stock market and even owning gold and silver.

Yeah. I think honestly, Roger, it really has hurt the growth of my platform and my podcast because I’m not hyper-focused on one thing. In fact, I know that to be true. If I had

just picked one topic, say real estate only or crypto only or stocks only, then I would,

just attract those types of people that are interested in that specific content and just keep piling them on, right?

Uh, provided that they like the value that I’m offering, but because I kind of talk about all these different things, um, I think that, you know, yeah, it’s, I just say it’s hurt, but I believe, I believe that that is, I’m doing the.

[23:56] Best in the best interests of my audience.

I’m serving my audience to what I feel is putting them in a position to create truly holistic wealth and in creating a more of a balanced attack and having having

their money in different asset classes is going to help to shield them from a lot of the volatility. Like I said, I mean, I have crypto, I have quite a bit in crypto, I have,

quite a bit in stocks. I have a lot of probably mostly 50% of all of my net worth is probably real estate, I would say. But when this whole crash happened this past year, like I said,

My net worth didn’t drop because I have so many stable cashflow producing assets that,

just all of a sudden all that cashflow comes back in and replenishes any of the hits that,

I take.

I was in a conference a couple of weekends ago and one of the speakers got up and said, I worked for 30 years in the financial services industry.

I was a stockbroker. I am a certified financial planner. I was.

I let my licenses lapsed. And here is why. I finally became convinced that these services and companies exist, first of all, to serve the needs of the person doing the selling, secondly, to serve the needs of the company,

thirdly, to serve the needs of that company’s shareholders, and fourthly, distant fourth,

the needs of the customers.

[25:16] Yeah. That just kind of confirmed for me something I’ve been suspicious of for a while, that really maybe the best way to be involved in some of these things is to get a little bit more direct to the source. Yeah. And I think a lot of those people, Roger, they’re great people. I mean,

I know so many financial advisors, I’m friends with them, I love them, their hearts are right,

but they are limited in terms of what they can offer because they’re regulated. They’re just selling regulated products, which are stocks and bonds and that’s it.

And, and you know, captive to one company. Yeah.

And captive to one company. So they’re limited on their offerings. I have none of that restricted me so I can just say whatever’s I think is best.

And I have gone on my show and you know, there have been times where I’ve promoted stuff that oftentimes I promote stuff that I don’t make any money on.

I mean, you know, I don’t make money from, you know, people buying, you know, crypto. I mean, I don’t make money from people buying stocks. Like I don’t sell those types of things. Right. So I just think that let’s do what’s best for the people that we’re trying to serve.

And everything else will eventually take care of itself.

[26:27] All right, Jack, man, we’ve got to wrap it up. I could talk to you forever on this, but we’re out of time.

Well, I just want to share what my number one investment is for 2023. And it’s not going to be what it’s not going to be what you think. All right, go for it. I may have to edit something

else out to get to this, but we’ll do it. Okay. Short form video. Short form video. That’s where I’m putting all of my money. And when I say all of it, I’m going all in. Now, will,

I buy other stuff? Yes, of course. But I mean, this is my hyper, hyper focus. Short form video for entrepreneurs. This is the greatest opportunity I think that we’ve ever seen in terms,

of being able to grow our businesses at a low cost. I’m spending money on video production, editing, because I can’t do that, but I’m going to crank out triple to quadruple the amount of short form videos this year. And that’s my focus, make more money.

Interesting. Short form meaning how long?

[27:33] 30 seconds to a minute. And you put in where? Um, every platform that makes sense. I use four, uh, tick, uh, Instagram reels is my top, but,

tick tock YouTube shorts now. And then I do do some of them on LinkedIn, whereas LinkedIn is a little bit more text heavy or a lot more text heavy, I should say platform. So I just use those

occasionally there, but when you get one good edited short form video, you can, you can get so much reach from that. Go out and buy Facebook ads and watch your bank account just get decimated.

[28:10] Or put the money into good production, good editing of a short form video.

You’ll crush your ROI. It won’t even be close. Very interesting. All right. He’s Jack Gibson. I’m Roger, of course. Jack, thank you. The website

is right there, buyingdestructiblewealth.com and head over there today, get this book. If you buy anything else for Christmas, buy this book first. Get this book, give it to a loved one. Parents,

give it to your children. If their teens are older, they can understand the concepts.

Get this book and then schedule a call with Jack. You’ve got to do this. You need to do this. And Jack’s been a friend of mine for a long time. I know his heart. I also know that he is real,

and he’s done what he says he’s done. Minddestructiblewealth.com. Jack, thanks for joining us today. Thanks so much, Roger. Appreciate it as always.

[29:09] Jonathan Swift said, a wise person should have money in their head, but not in their heart. Great thoughts. And what a great conversation with Jack Gibson today. Thank you for joining

us everyone we love you we appreciate you remember keep your eyes open.

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